Growth & Conflict Quickfires

In this episode, Kate and Eric talk all about Unlearning, Healing, and Growing Through Conflict.

Topics:
➡️ What Kate and Eric had to unlearn to grow together
➡️ How they handle resentment and repair after conflict
➡️ Why independence and authenticity are essential in long-term marriage

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TRANSCRIPT:

Alright, hey Evolve Nation. Welcome back. Hello, Evolve Nation. 00:16 I was just sitting there like with a smile on. That's good. I like it. That's like great for the thumbnail. 00:22 I need to get used to like being in I'm like really weird. I am a robot. That's okay. Look at the camera. 00:27 We're in the last round of our quick fires quick fires. Yeah marriage and partnership the second one around intimacy and connection and then this last set that I put together is on growth and Conflict. Yeah, and these are questions that we have been receiving from our Instagram followers and that's been 00:54 fun. I love that. I love receiving questions from listeners. So if you ever have a question feel free to send away. 01:02 There's so many ways to communicate with us. Yeah, we're pretty active on there. Uh, you can just email me or us eric at evolvedmarriage.com or just go on Instagram send us a DM on Facebook and ask us your question. 01:12 We'd we compile them all. Um, if it's a really deep question, typically what we'll do is we'll do a whole episode about it. 01:17 Yeah, sometimes, sometimes you have to do a whole episode out of question and it's just thank you. We got some really great ideas. 01:23 Yeah. And then every now and then I'll compile a bunch of quick fires here so Kate and I can just, uh, go through them. 01:28 I mean, we've been together 21 years. 21 years. So we've messed up a lot and we've made a lot of mistakes. 01:33 We've grown a lot. And so now we're trying to help you. Not make as many mistakes. No, you're going to make mistakes. 01:39 It's cool. It's part of being in a marriage. Four, five, six, seven. Okay, so seven questions. Seven that I put together. 01:45 Growth and conflict. So the first one, uh, what's one thing you each had to unlearn to grow together? Wow. I, you know, I feel like I have an answer for you, but I don't have an answer for me. 02:00 Okay. Good. Cause I don't even have an answer for anyone. Okay. Well, I'm going to speak for myself first. I had to unlearn that, uh, I could succeed more on my own than I could with another. 02:19 For a big part of my life, I had a belief that it was up to me. Lone at the top, being independent, I got this, can't count on people. 02:30 And, uh. That's a big one. Yeah, I think our marriage, also a lot, you know, other areas, but certainly our marriage made me realize that, oh, like, uh, if I actually kind of let Kate in, open myself up to her ideas, like, I can actually do way better. 02:47 Like, even as I'm saying that now as a mature person. Do you think that way? But, yeah, definitely a time in our marriage. 02:52 I person in the world thinking that. Yeah, where I'm like, I have the answers, and as long as we do things my way, it's gonna work out. 02:59 So, just follow my lead, it's all up to me. And then I realize, like, oh, man, this is not working. 03:04 Like, Kate has so much to offer our relationship, and I've just been kind of shutting you out, stunting your voice, convincing you that you don't have a voice in our marriage. 03:16 Yeah. Of trying to, because I'm like, hey, Eric's way. Yeah. That's my way of staying in control, but that's something I had to unlearn. 03:20 I think that, for me, it would be that. I think you pinpointed it, but I'm curious to know what you thought it was. 03:28 Oh, I, the first thing that came to me was, like, the patriarchy, like, uhm, you know. Like, I didn't, uh, my dad wasn't around. 03:37 So, you know, like, I grew up with a lot of very strong women, and this idea of, like, women's empowerment, like, women can do whatever, was something that I witnessed at a very young age. 03:46 Yeah, and I grew up in a very traditional home, where, like, the men led the home, and it was, like, dad's boss. 03:51 Dad's the boss. He makes the choices. Dad, dad is the, uhm, undertaker. What is that, like, the? Dad's the undertaker. 03:59 He holds the power. Yeah, so I think that's- What's an undertaker? Somebody who, like, gets bodies ready and puts them under the ground. 04:07 Oh, shit. I mean, sometimes he was that mad. But yeah, I think you brought a lot of that, like, into our marriage of, like, deferring to me. 04:17 Yeah. Like, oh, Eric needs to make the choice. I remember, like, even up until, like, a couple years ago, you would, like, ask me permi- You'd call me and ask me permission to buy things. 04:25 And it wasn't, like, big things. It was, like, I'm gonna spend- I'm gonna buy bananas. I'm gonna $50. Can I buy bananas? 04:31 Whoa, that's not bad. I wanna make banana muffins. It wasn't that. It was, like, $30, you know? Yeah. I Kate, just buy whatever you want. Like, I don't care. Okay. But yeah, anyways, so- But I do- Okay, maybe- Yeah, But I think that kind comes with, like, the whole patriarchy. 04:51 I think, like, because, you know, Eric is the man, I can't have an opinion or an idea or say something that might cross them. 04:59 I think you've been so good at doing that. Like, I look at you sometimes now and I'm like, yes, you're a f****** badass. 05:05 Yeah, like, I am, like- I'm a baddie. I'm getting hot right now. I'm just thinking about it. So yeah, I think that's something we had to- To unlearn. 05:14 I want to read the next one. All right. Hiiii, what's your most powerful repair tool after conflict? Running away for the hills. 05:25 Just like a black belt level of avoidance. Just like- You know, I'll- to give a serious answer, text messaging. Yeah. 05:35 Yeah, we, you know, it's so funny. No, it was a black belt great tool until we abused it. Yeah, okay. 05:44 But, but I still will say- I think, I think sending one message or two with, like, a heartfelt, like, here's really what I could say if I could not be interrupted. 05:57 I think we should start emailing soon. It sounds like you're working through some trauma. I am. Our last conflict. Eric was overboard. 06:06 Eric and I went overboard on the text messages and the conflict continued through text. So I think next time it would be safer to have, like, text. 06:13 But I think putting it in writing- It's carrier pigeon. So, if I do, can I jump in and finish my thought? 06:20 Is that cool? Or just- Go for it. No, I'm just going to take over this show. And this is the Kate Pond Show. 06:25 So, the reason I say that is because, uhm, a lot of times we have, like, worked through our conflict by texting each other back and forth. 06:36 I think it gives us the opportunity to, uh, you know, for me to have to look through my words, to write them out. 06:43 I think it gives you the opportunity not to, like, have Eric getting super intense and in your face. You know, we have a different communication style. 06:49 Yeah, and I will often, I, I have to think of my words more, and sometimes, like, the texts will happen, like, two hours after the fight. 06:58 And for me, it's, I had time to, like, think and digest and be like, okay, oh, here's what I could say. 07:06 Yeah. Because oftentimes when we are in a argument, I'll, like, a couple hours later, I'll be like, I should have said this when he said that, and I should have said this when he said that, and I'm still like, ah, man. 07:18 I'm gonna get him. Why didn't I think that? No, it's not even about get him, it's like, oh, man, in that moment, like, I should have apologized. 07:24 Right then and there, I should have apologized. I had such a good burn. Not like comebacks. Not like a roast queen, like, I'm not in, like, grade five here, like, I'm gonna roast him so bad. 07:35 Yeah, so I, I would say for me that, that has been one of the most powerful tools, and it's so funny, because it goes against, like, a lot of the advice of, like, oh, just talk about it in person, like, don't text, and what I have come to realize, at least for us, is, like, actually, it's better that 07:49 I text. Yeah, I think, yeah, for sure. And and oftentimes what happens, we'll text, and then later on, we'll talk. 07:57 Yeah, or even, like, I'll send the last text, or you'll send the last text. And, like, right after I read it, we come together, like, we see each other, like, in person, hug it out, and, like, apologize, and really, like, have a heart-to-heart. 08:09 Or, like, even, like, the, there's oftentimes, when, like, we'll go to bed angry, right? Because, you know, somebody says don't go to bed angry, that's baloney. 08:15 Don't stay up fighting all night till 3 a.m. That's horrible. But, yeah, eventually you're exhausted, and you're in your lizard brain anyway. 08:22 So, oftentimes, like, we'll just be angry with each other, so we just go to bed, like, I'm angry, I'm angry. 08:25 You're, like, I'm angry. Good night. You know, we won't say anything. Uh, and then the next morning, when the kids are up, and we're all up, we're not going to, like, open up a can while we're getting ready to go to school. 08:34 So, oftentimes, what'll happen is, like, I'll receive a text midday, or I'll send you a text, or a voicemail midday. 08:39 And then we're able to, like, listen to it at our own pace, our own leisure, and then, typically, when we come back home from that day of work, or whatever, well, you'll come back home from a day of work, we're able to then come together and say, you know, oh, hey, I got your message. 08:51 Thanks. Like, yeah, I'm sorry, and that kind of stuff. And so, I think that's a great way for us to communicate, because if we, if I didn't have that outlet to send you a message apologizing, it would be hard for me, right, because I'm anxiously attached. 09:03 So, I'm, like, I need a way to, like, send Kate a message, and I think I've been really good at just, like, I'm sending this out. 09:07 If she reads it great, if she doesn't, great. You know, but I'm able to Yeah, and also, it also allows me to read when I'm ready, because sometimes, like, I'm so mad about it, and I'm, like, I know this is going to be an apology text, but I'm going to withhold the apology. 09:21 Yeah, yeah, so you get to deal with it kind of in your own way. And it's better than, like, 37 missed calls from Eric, like we used to do. 09:26 Oh, yeah. Yeah. You're living with a psychopath. Alright, next one. How do you deal with resentment when it comes creeps in? 09:40 I don't, I never resent Eric. Kate just holds onto it all the time. Like, I just, I don't, I don't resent you because I can sweep it so freaking deep under my rug. 09:47 Like, I don't even trip on my rug. Just like, I'm fine. This rug is fine. 09:58 It's Persian. What happens, so you, you repress That's it. Okay. No. Okay. Yes. I used to repress it. Let's be serious. 10:08 What is it? What is the question? How do you deal with resentment when it creeps in? I usually talk it out with somebody. 10:17 Yeah. Not with me. Not with you. Not yet. The first, not the first. You're not the first person I talked to with. 10:23 Oh yes, Siri. I usually talk to a friend. Sometimes if I have an appointment with my therapist, I'll talk to my therapist about it. 10:34 But I will definitely talk to somebody about it and be like, oh, it's making me so mad. And like, it helps lower the fire a little bit so that I either realize, I mean, I'm being a little super dramatic about this, or this is something I need to talk to Eric about ASAP. 10:55 Yeah. Sometimes it's just, it's good for you just to like hear your intensity out loud. Yeah. Right? Yeah. In terms of the level that I'm pissed off. 11:01 And to like, be intense in a safe space so that I'm not coming guns blazing with you because that tends to hurt your feelings more than have an impact on our relationship. 11:14 It has a negative impact versus having like a positive impact that I wish it would have. So if I can like, you know, yell at one of my girlfriends about it and just be like, ah, I'm so angry about this and just let it out. 11:28 And then, you know, they're a safe space for me. Um, then I can come, I'm going to come back to Eric and be like, listen, I'm, I'm pretty angry about this. 11:37 And I don't want to have to like get so aggressive and angry about it because like that anger is already gone. 11:43 Yeah. I think that's really great. You know, I, I have two ways. The first is gratitude. This is like the pivot, right? 11:50 A lot of people kind of overlook. So this is, this is the thing too with gratitude. Like I remember when, this is like way back when people told me about gratitude. 11:56 Like, I thought it was such like a frou-frou baloney thing, right? what a waste of time. And, but actually gratitude is been, has had the most impact on my life. 12:07 Like I'm comfortable in saying that. Like we literally have a gratitude channel in our, uh, Evolvement's Collective. Like practicing gratitude every day has changed my life. 12:15 Yeah. And it also, I think that that's the one thing that saved our marriage. I remember I had put up some little whiteboards in the kitchen and every single day, like this was like while you were going to going through sobriety and things like that. 12:29 Um, I wrote something I was grateful for and man, at the beginning it was tough. Like I was like, I'm grateful for the fact that Eric didn't yell at me this morning. 12:40 Like he woke up this morning cause it's really like there was some mornings he didn't. And so it was like little things at first and little things at first. 12:50 And then I started seeing him in a different light. And I started seeing this new Eric, like not the Eric I hated. 12:54 It was like this Eric that I actually had potential for me to fall in love with him again. So I was like, that, that was a big pivot in our relationship gratitude. 13:05 So I definitely agree like as much as it might be frou-frou it definitely, and it was on frou-frou boards too. 13:12 Do you remember those boards? I love them. I still have those. I wonder what happened with them, Eric. So I think for me, gratitude has also been good. 13:20 And especially in the moment, right? Like this is often what happens is like, um, because if you think about what resentment is, it's like, uh, an expectation that you have of somebody that's unmet, right? That's all resentment is. 13:30 It's like, uh, this idea like Kate should be doing this and she didn't do it. Or Kate should act this way and she did this instead. 13:36 And then it builds resentment. Right? So that's kind of what resentment is. And so in those moments for me, when something like that happens, I just stop and I kind of step into gratitude. 13:45 And it's the idea of like giving your partner like a positive intent, like this idea, like just seeing you in a positive light. 13:50 So it happens all the time. Sometimes like you come home from school like a bat out of hell and just like, and the kids too. 13:54 And I've said this before, like when our kids come home from school, it's like they explode. Like it's just like, it's like they were a body with all their stuff on it and they boom, boom, boom, their bags are here, their shoes are here, their food's Oh that could be a whole episode if we ever do a parenting 14:06 episode. Kids do explode after school. So in those moments, sometimes, you know, because I'll come in the kitchen, I'm a neat guy. 14:14 Right? And so sometimes I look at the kitchen and I'm like, oh God, like Kate, why are you dropping all your crap here and blah, blah, blah. 14:19 And so then in that moment, I pivot and I'm like, Hey, Kate works hard during the day. You know, Eric, she's really helpful. 14:26 There's a lot of stuff in the house and I'm just gonna clean this up. It's all good. You know what I mean? 14:30 So that's like a really simple one. Um, the other thing, same, exactly the same as you. I have people in my life that I talk to, that know I love you. 14:41 This is the beauty, right? You need to be around people that know you love your wife. Like we have guys that, like, very tight knit group of friends. 14:48 And when my buddy tells me something negative about his wife. There's no question. Yeah, it's still like you deeply love your wife in this moment. 14:55 You're really annoyed with her. Yeah, and it's funny. I have had some girlfriends say like, I love my husband. But, and I'm like, you don't even have to say that. 15:03 Like I know it. Just skip that part. Just go straight out to like, I hate my husband right now. And it's like, I don't know. And like, well, have you thought about like the future? 15:12 It's, no, I'm never leaving, like, I'm not leaving. My partner. Yeah. But right now, I'm super annoyed. So I, just like you, I have friends like that where I can, you know, I even do just like a voice memo sometimes. 15:22 I'm like, dude, I just gotta load on you. This is what's happening. This is what I'm thinking, blah, blah, blah. 15:25 My buddy would be like, hey man, thanks. I hear you. Yeah, I hear you. It sucks. Yeah, you know. And I know, and I trust our friends. 15:32 That next time they see me, they're gonna think really nice things about me. Yeah, my girlfriends think really nice things about me. 15:39 You. I agree. And I think, after all, the poopy things you do. Yeah. And this is so important is like, you, you want to open up to people about these things that have the emotional maturity and the emotional intelligence to understand like what a, like what it takes to keep a long term relationship together 15:53 . Yeah. And how you're going to go through ups and downs and, and I've had so many girlfriends tell me, you know, like, Kate, whatever you decide to do in this moment. 16:03 I totally respect you. There's nothing you can do or say or whatever. That's going to change my opinion about you or about Eric. 16:11 Like, I know this is hard. I know relationships are hard. I love both of you. Like. Yeah. So I would say that's, that's a great way of dealing with resentment. 16:20 The next one, uh, what's something your partner helped you see about yourself? Good reading. What? Oh yeah, it's good. But something your partner helped you see about yourself. 16:31 What's something your partner helped you see about me? I. What did I help you see in yourself? That I, oh my gosh. 16:42 That's, Eric has a very different way of seeing life that I have ever seen life. So, I was very much raised in a, like, very linear home. 16:55 This is the path that is laid out for you. You follow this path, you retire, then you die kind of thing. 17:01 Like, it's like, This blueprint. This is the blueprint. And you don't pivot off that path because it may not be safe. 17:09 And you have allowed me to see that there are, Many different roads you can take that take you off of that, very linear path that still allow you to comeback to your path. 17:23 But, do you know sometimes you can veer off of it? Or sometimes you veer off of it. And you're like... F*** the first bath, I'm going on to this next one that's way better. 17:32 Like, then what I ever anticipated that first path to be. So I think you have allowed me to- you see growth and my potential and see what I'm able to do. 17:44 I don't think I would have done half the things that I have done, um, right now if it hadn't been for you, you know, encouraging me to get off the linear path and to do things and take risks and make mistakes and try and, I sound- No, no, I think that's pretty accurate, you know, in the sense that, like 18:08 , I have always kind of marched with my own drum. That's why I, that's what made me fall for you. I was like, damn, this guy's a rebel. 18:17 I love it. Sometimes it's, you know, has led to kind of the deep end on certain things. I don't think so. 18:25 I don't think it ever got us in any trouble. I'll see you I don't. I a lot of it's like an adventure, right? 18:29 It's like, hey, we should do this in the mic. We're going to do it. Stop texting people. No, I was, I was sending you a voice, ma'am, always. 18:35 I'm reading your text. Um, for me, what's something your partner helps you see by yourself? You know, that sounds really tacky, but, um, like, I, I, I really think you made me, you make me feel like I'm a good man. 18:50 Like, you believe in me, certainly when I was, like, down on myself sometimes, and still not, sometimes. But, like, you believe in me, like, nobody else believes in me. 19:02 And, you know, you talked about, like, oh, like, Eric can kind of march to be his own drum. I think part of, there's two reasons for that. 19:07 Number one is that there is a level of trust that I have in you to be, like, I'm with you. 19:16 You know, there's been times when I'm, like, have really debated hard decisions in my life. And I'm, like, I, like, I, I think I need to keep doing this thing that I hate, you know, and I can't take this pivot and you're, like, you gotta, like, follow your heart, Eric, I'll be with you no matter what 19:31 . Like, we'll be okay, but I think you need to, like, you know, stop doing this thing, you know, like, or whatever. 19:36 And, like, I don't know that I would have done a lot of the things- I've done without you and your belief in me. 19:41 And I think especially just, like, you know, there's times when it's, like, I question whether or not I'm a good man. 19:48 And, like, your words, your belief in me have, like, propped me up in those moments. And so, thanks for that. 19:55 And, on the other side of that is oftentimes, and this, I think that a lot of men kind of feel this way. 20:01 It's different now because we have kids, because I- with. But there's been times in my life where, like, uh, like, I didn't have anybody to- I didn't have anything to fight for except you. 20:10 Like, like, like, it was like, um, it's this idea that, like, uh, you know, when you really don't love yourself enough, like, you need to do it for somebody else. 20:19 Like, you need to do things for somebody else, right? And so it becomes easier when you have kids. It's like now, like, it's like, you know, there's things I do. 20:24 There's plenty of things I don't like doing that I do anyways. But I do them to better f- for my kids, you know? 20:29 But there was times in my life where, like, I think about this a lot. Like, if you weren't in my life, I don't know where I would end up. 20:35 But, like, the fact that you were there and you were counting on me, and you were like, hey, like, this is what I need from you. 20:39 This is what I want for my future. That I was like, you're f****** creating this area. Like, you're doing it. 20:45 You're gonna work your butt off. You're gonna make this woman, you know, you're gonna help this woman have a good life. And so, yeah, I think there's- You're gonna make me have a good life- Well, what you were gonna say? 20:52 It was like this idea of, like, I have something to fight for because in the end, like, I was just so down on myself. 20:56 It's like, well, you're not fighting for yourself when it cares about your own life, you know? Cause you're just so down on yourself. 21:01 And I think men really experience this, especially, like, as they go through really hard situations or their partners aren't around. 21:06 It's like, you know, I was laughing with another guy, you know, he's like, man, my wife and kids go, like, on a trip. 21:12 Like, I don't know what to do with myself. You know, it's like, well, yeah, because you have nobody- You deserve, right? 21:17 Cause you don't really have a relationship with yourself. So it's like, you have to, like, figure out how to do your own things, you know? And, so I think a lot of men out there literally just live for their wife and kids. 21:24 And sometimes that's okay, but I don't know that that's good, like, long term. No, no, I think you, yeah, that's a whole episode in itself. 21:32 Yeah, yeah. Finding independence in your relationships. It's so easy. It's so easy to lose and it's so important to continue. 21:39 Yeah, which raises the- In expression, which is, how do you balance independence and togetherness? Right? We often talk about this. 21:46 I mean, COVID helped us really figure this out. Yeah. Um, but it's like, how do you, like, how can you be individuals in relationship? 21:56 Honestly, I think planning out your weeks, making sure that you put time in the calendar for your- relationship, making sure you put time on the calendar for yourself, for your other relationships. 22:09 Umm, I think, unfortunately, it doesn't sound sexy, but planning ahead, making sure that you prioritize what is important for you having a clear set of values, having a clear- clear boundaries about things. 22:28 Having things you're saying no to saying yes to your relationship and saying yes to everything else. I think that's how we really balance that out, because, I'd have to say, we have very individual, um. 22:44 Hobbies lives. Hobbies, things that we do, like, you have things you do, I have things I do that are completely separate. 22:51 it. I Um, we spend a lot of time apart. Um, and I think something that I'm learning right now is, even though maybe sometimes in a day you only have, like, an hour with your partner, or 30 minutes, like, make that hour, or that 30 minutes count. 23:10 Don't make that hour or 30 minutes more time for yourself if you're already- All right. The taking time for yourself. 23:18 So if I have a night, an evening where I'm, you know, going to yoga, I'm working at the yoga studio, so I'm gonna be there for three hours. 23:26 I worked all day, and I know that, you know, I have, like, an hour after my shift where I'm gonna be, you know, able to hang out with Eric, maybe 30 minutes talk to him because then I'll be too tired. 23:39 I know that I'm not gonna have- the energy for my relationship that night, but I do make sure that I show up, like, and that I'm really showing up for those 30 minutes. 23:48 Like, my phone is put away. I'm, you know, intentionally talking to him, making sure I'm asking him questions, making sure that we're connecting so that, you know, I'm really balancing out, like, that really, really busy day when I'm not around. 24:04 Mm-hmm. And maybe it means that, like, I'm sending him text messages throughout the day and reminding him how great he is and how much I love him. 24:12 And so, um, I think that that's how I balance it out. Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. Like, I think you need to be better with your time management. 24:23 And so not only, like, sitting together, but, yeah, I agree. Like, I think, like, like, You know, again, even people that say they're busy, you know, sometimes I think about this all the time, like, people say they're busy and then we really sit down. 24:33 It's like, hey, the first thing I say is, like, hey, pull up your phone and pull up your screen time. 24:36 I want to see it, right? And it's like, you know, two hours on Instagram and it's like, hey, dude, like, you're not too busy, you're actually just distracted. 24:44 Yeah. And so I think it's really important to manage your time, exactly what you're saying. It's like, um, you know, uhh, don't spend the quality time that I could be spending with my partner. 24:56 Don't make that a long time for me. Yeah. And then also take a long time during the day when I can. 25:00 You know, it's like, try to find this good balance for yourself so that all these aspects of your life feel fulfilled. 25:05 And it's also like some people need a bit less in certain categories and the seasons are different, right? Yep. There are some seasons where, you know, I remember when you were going through yoga certification or writing your book or things like, like that. 25:16 Like, you were so focused on these goals that like, we had to come to this agreement where it was just like, hey, like, I'm not gonna be around a lot. 25:24 Like, I'm gonna need your help. You know what I mean? And, and so that's another part, like, for me, what I would say, you know, you're right. 25:30 Like, planning is really important. But the other part too is, um, like, helping your partner achieve their goals. I think it's really, really important. 25:38 Because, to me, uuuh, uuh, like, whenever you do something on your own, it doesn't feel like I'm lacking. Like, it actually feels awesome, you know? 25:46 It's like, sure sometimes, like, I, you know, I have a tough day because it's only me with the kids because you're doing yoga or whatever. 25:51 But for the most part, like, I'm actually really proud that you're doing that. You know, and we guys laugh about this. 25:58 We were laughing together the other day, but it's like, somebody says, like, oh, I already do too much. Like, you should do less. 26:01 You shouldn't go, and it's like, what else are you gonna do? Sit at home and just like, scroll on your phone. 26:04 Let's back to All right. It's like, oh, I'm glad that you're out here doing these things. And so I think that's a big part of it is like, you have to trust that your partner is gonna be okay, like in those moments when you're out there taking care of yourself. 26:13 Like, you have to trust that I got it handled. And this is like, partners don't really trust each other to handle it for whatever reason, right? 26:20 Maybe it's like, I'm afraid that when I come back from the gym, you're gonna get mad at me. It's like, no, you have to trust that your partner's gonna handle their own crap. 26:26 And that by you go to the gym, you gotta figure it out, but then come back. You can like, help out in whatever you can. 26:30 And so I think that's another thing too, is you have to trust that your partner also wants you to have your own life. 26:37 Yeah. And having open conversations about that's important, right? Yeah, and I think it kind of goes back to something I said, and I think it was in the last episode where it's like, hey, if I am missing you, if I'm lacking that connection, if, you know, you you've been, I've been working on my book, 26:54 like, and I've been really busy. Or like, you're right now, you're, like, you're really, really busy with, like, you know, working on your, your business and, and, you know, doing some new things for it, coming up with new courses and things like that. 27:06 Um, you know, it would be easy for me to come up to you and be like, I miss you, we never hang out, it sucks, like, you're, you're so busy with your work. 27:16 What would be actually better is to be like, hey Eric, like, I really miss you and I want to hang out. 27:24 I got some really nice ingredients for us to make a meal together. What's a good night to do it this week? 27:30 Yep. And then it's like, hey, I'm, I'm free on, on Friday. Okay, great, let's do it on Friday. Like. And I think we have the agreement just to jump in, but like, in that moment, we trust each other, like, you're like, oh, I'm going to get Eric's full attention. 27:42 Yeah. Friday night, Eric's with me. Yeah. And that's why it's important for me to go up to you and to say, like, hey, here's a specific activity I want to do with you. You know, it's going to take an hour or two, maybe when can you fit me in? 27:56 Like, I get, I get that you're busy. I get it. And I'm not trying to take that away from you. You know, You know, you've got people like You, you have spoken to that, like, they're, they're working on their thesis or their wife is writing their, like, a doctorate PhD or something. 28:14 Like, that's a hardcore thing. Like, that's, that's a lot of work. But, you know, finding those little moments where you can just check in or just be together. 28:24 Go for a walk together. Like, just go for, like, a 30-minute walk and just- really be together. So, that's definitely a great way to balance out. 28:33 Yeah, I like that. Yeah. So, next one, we have two more. So, what's one value? Uh, you both try to live by in your marriage. 28:42 So, I guess, like, a value or principle. Hmm. Value or principle? Yeah. So, for me, one of the principles that I believe is really, really important. 28:51 I think more people- should hear to this. So, we're talking about differentiation a lot, but, uh, I think it's actually really important for us to be ourselves in the marriage. Yeah. 29:01 And I think that comes with a level of maturity. But I think a lot of times we hide parts of ourselves in order to be accepted by our partner. 29:08 We actually learn this at a very young age, right? Like, we hide parts of ourselves to be loved by our parents, et cetera. 29:13 But I actually think that for us, like, the growth, you know, and why our marriage- you exist, it's for us to grow more into who we are, is actually to, uhm, the principle is to try to be more of yourself and learn to get closer to your partner every day. 29:29 Mm-hmm. Now, if you're in a situation where you, you know, if I'm ever in a situation where I'm like, oh, in order to be accepted by Kate, I have to hide these parts of myself, that to me is a red flag. 29:38 So that's going against my principle Now take off Oh, in order for me to be close to you, I have to hide these parts of myself. 29:43 That actually goes against my belief in marriage. Mm-hmm. Now there's things that I'm going to show and you're not going to like them. 29:48 And we're going to have to work through them. Right? And there's things that you love and you, you open up about and I don't like them. 29:53 Right? And we have to work through them. But I think if you, if you just hide parts of yourself in order to be in relationship, then you're being, you know, authentic, that not only sucks for you because you're essentially living a fake life. 30:03 You're essentially creating a life for somebody who's not really you. But also it kind of sucks for your partner. Mm-hmm. 30:08 Because they never get to be with the true version of you, which, let's be real, they can often feel. Right? 30:13 And so I think for me, that's really, really important as president. Authenticity. Yeah, just like being, learning to open yourself up to more of who you are within the relationship. 30:22 Right. Plenty of people have, are like really good at being themselves when they're on their own. But then as soon as they get in a relationship, they can't be, they- They can't be themselves. 30:30 Yeah. They're like constantly trying to manipulate, control the situation. Yeah, and then they hate being in a relationship, and then you wonder why. 30:36 Yeah, and they're all those tents, and they don't know, and they need their partner to be a certain way. It's like, actually a great relationship is when I am my way. 30:42 Kate is her way, to the most that we can possibly be as individuals. And then we just work through the tension, and build resilience, to open ourselves up to closeness. 30:50 Yeah. Like, that's kind of how we've run our marriage. Yeah. Yeah, I like that. That's great. Yeah. Um, I think for me, it would be definitely that your relationship is an opportunity for you to grow alongside another person. I think that we tend to put a lot of pressure on our marriage to be these people, 31:16 these individuals, and we kind of tend to forget that, like, We're growing older. Things are happening in our lives. Things are changing. 31:22 We're changing as people. We're gonna evolve as a couple. Um, we're gonna evolve as parents. Um, a lot of exterior things are gonna happen. 31:34 So, you know, as nice as it is to say, like, I do, and forever. That's harder to do. And, uh, um, but I think for me, I said forever. 31:47 And I stick by that. Like, I understand and I have a lot of grace for you in moments where I can see that you're transitioning into a new phase of your life into, or maybe you're like testing it, right? 32:02 You're like, uhh, am I gonna do this or am I gonna do th- And I might not like where you're going, but I'm gonna be behind you and I'm gonna be like, I'm gonna, I'm gonna let him test these waters and see where it's going. 32:13 And I'm gonna try to, like, you know, grow alongside you and understand that you're not always gonna be the eric I married 21 years ago. 32:23 But also, like, grow alongside you and try to also- So, you know, bring you on my journey. And so, I think that both of us have these different journeys in our lives and I think that your marriage can serve as having that, like, boy with you all the time. 32:45 Having that, like, kind of life vest with you all the time. Like, no matter what, like, we're not gonna drown. 32:52 Cause I'm here, or you're here. And, like, we'll be each other's life vest for all these turbulent times that we're gonna go through in our, in our lives. 33:02 And I have this, like, my heart aches for, like, marriages who go through these turbulent times and, like, end. And I'm like, man, like, what if you just tried being each other's life vest? 33:16 Like, what if you just gee- of them grace? And I know there's some things that are, like, irreparable. Like, I'm not passing judgment on people who get separated. 33:25 Like, I'm sure everybody has the reasons to do so. But I feel like we have gone through shit. Like, we have gone through some really rough times and have come out on top and, like, bigger and better. 33:38 Yeah, like, our marriage wouldn't be what it is now if we go through that stuff together. Exactly. And I think that that is kind of, like, my stance, value, kind of maybe, like, when it comes to marriage. 33:49 Yeah, it reminds me of an old Esther Pearl quote, you know, I mean, a couple of years ago I think I read it, but it was, like, uh, every adult will have three or four romantic relationships in their life. 34:00 It's up to you to decide if you want it with the same person. Mm-hmm. Right? And I think it's true, like, you're, You know, you're a different person than you were when we met. 34:08 You'll probably be a different person 20 years from now. Yeah. And we're still together. Yeah. So I think it is important, and I think actually even the acceptance of that actually opens yourself up. 34:17 Yeah. Because a lot of people refuse to accept that people change. Mm-hmm. And they're like, it needs to go back to the way it was. 34:22 And so just accepting of that is the thing is a really big deal. Do you want to read the last one? 34:26 What's one thing you're working on in your relationship? Right now. Ooh, hot as damn. Just keep it real. Yeah. It's firey. 34:33 You want the honest answer? Uh, yeah. I mean, so, you know, a couple months ago, we were at a point where we were deciding whether, I would say we, but, you know, I was certainly in a place where I was deciding whether or not I wanted to continue, uh, our marriage. 34:53 Mm-hmm. Or if we- We're gonna move to a co-parenting relationship. Certainly I was in the boat of, like, hey, let's create some space for ourselves, and I think that was, uh, I, I was going through all kinds of things personally, uh, so that created a lot of tension. 35:07 I, I think, for me, like, when I look at what we're working on right now, uh, I think still a lot of healing. 35:13 Um, certainly, like, I, I realize that, like, a lot of the skeletons that we've had in our closet. Uh, are, are kind of rearing their ugly heads in a certain way, right? 35:22 Like, the, the versions, the perceptions we have of each other, um, are still things that we need to work through. 35:29 And, and so I think for me, like, when I'm working through now, you know, obviously, you know, we, we've decided to recommit to our relationship and choose each other. 35:36 And we've both made that commitment to each other to continue. Uh, and then- for me, I think what I'm really working through is to, um, like, really live in the now, in the present moment, instead of, like, living in these future fears that I might have, like, oh, like, you know, I'll never solve this 35:57 problem, you know? Obviously, I'm, this part of me is like, you know, I have so much drive, and I'm like, I want things to improve. 36:04 I want things to be the best. I want to move towards- Our second question what in the these things, but I realize that sometimes in our marriage, uh, in a lot of aspects of my life, is like, uh, it's like 90% isn't good enough, you know? 36:14 So it's like, I'm so focused on the 10%. I'm like, this 10% needs to be solved, and if it can't be solved, this can't work. 36:19 And I think I've, I've really started to mature in a place where I'm like, our marriage is awesome. You know what I mean? 36:29 And- It could be more awesome, and my experience of it could be more awesome, and I could feel more connected to you. 36:35 If I just stopped focusing on everything that wasn't perfect. You know, and so I think that for me has been my journey lately, and certainly like being less critical about you, about us, about our marriage, about our life. 36:47 I think it's things that I'm healing through. Mm-hmm. Yeah, what about you? Uh, for me, it's definitely, finding my voice, um, speaking, not letting things boil as much, bottle things up as much. 37:06 Um, you know, and that all comes down to really like speaking, starting to make a little noise in this marriage, and not in a like a make noise and rock the boat. 37:18 We'll see you part of thing, but not be afraid to rock the boat if I have to, and not be afraid to share my ideas, share my gifts, um, speak my truth, talk about what's on my heart, what's on my mind. 37:36 Um, I think that that's really been a big focus for me, and just really- showing up more as, like, my authentic self instead of the version I think that you want as a wife. 37:50 It's discovering, like, who is Kate? Now, this version of Kate as a wife, because I know who Kate was as a wife, like, you know, ten years ago, twenty years ago, but, like, now we have kids- It's where at a different- like, older kids, where at a different stage of life, like, who is Kate as a wife now 38:14 ? And, like, not who do I think Eric wants, it's who do I want to be, and how do I want to show up as a wife? 38:22 And it's- it's discovering that, and really trying to- well, with me, it's, like, with all aspects of my life, like- who am I- as a mom now, who am I as a woman now? 38:33 Like, I've gone through all these changes and- and- and done these courses and gotten all these, like, certifications and, like, done all these things, but, like, now what? 38:45 And so that's kind of where I'm at, and I think that showing up more authentically in this marriage and- and really, you know, st stop- stopping to, like, try to do things to please you, but to actually do things because that it is authentically who I am and how I want to show up. 39:07 I think that that's what's going to have the biggest impact on our marriage right now. Yeah, I love that. And that's great. 39:16 So that wraps us up for, uh, this week's- episode. Yeah, ending it on a very serious note. That's okay. Yeah, if you're listening to this on YouTube, we love- if you could subscribe, give us a like, uh, if you are on Spotify or Apple, uh, just leave us a rating and review. That always really helps us 39:29 out. Words of affirmation, right? I love language. We love, uh, we love some kind of words. But, uh, more than anything, you know, if you want more resources, go to evolvemarish.com to check out everything we offer- there. 39:43 Uh, and if you are a man who feels a little bit stuck in his relationship and wants to learn to lead his marriage and family through healthy masculine leadership, uh, you can apply to join us in the Evolvements Collective. 39:52 More than happy to talk with you one-on-one to see where you're at and whether or not it's a good fit for you. 39:56 Otherwise, we'll see