In this episode, we explore effective ways for partners to support each other through stress and anger, emphasizing empathy, communication, and self-care.

Topics:
➡️ How to empathetically understand and respond to a partner's stress and anger without internalizing their emotions.
➡️ Strategies for communicating effectively during stressful moments and providing support that respects both partners' needs.
➡️ The importance of setting healthy boundaries and practicing self-care while helping a partner navigate their emotional challenges.

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TRANSCRIPT

Eric MacDougall
So today we're talking about specifically what we want to do is help partners who maybe are married to, you know, a husband or a wife who typically is stressed out quick to anger, quick to irritability. You know, how do we help that partner engage with them in a way that feels good to both partners?

Kate MacDougall
Yeah. And sometimes in a relationship, it can be one partner who's kind of more stressed out quicker to lash out quicker to like React than the other. But sometimes it's 5050. You know, sometimes there's some days where it's one partner the next day, it's another partner. Sometimes it's both partners. So it just really depends on the dynamic of your relationship.

Eric MacDougall
Yeah, so in our relationship, typically I am, like I talked about earlier, like the maximizer is I'm typically the one that when I'm stressed out, I go out of me, which is I get loud, I get irritable, I get Curt, etc.

Kate MacDougall
Yeah, right. Yeah. And for me, I'm kind of more quiet. So when I stressed out, I kind of didn't really ever, like retreat, go inside, get very quiet. And I don't talk much. But then once in a while, very rarely, but once in a while, the stress just becomes too much. And then I like blow up. But I mean, neither are the healthiest. Right? But what's important is, you know, when you're blowing up, when you're stressed, when you're, you know, angry? What is it that you're doing in that moment? That's where when we talk about it's not healthy, it's it's not necessarily that it's not healthy, to be stressed, or angry? Or, you know, experiencing a strong emotion. What's not Healthy is the way that emotion comes out.

Eric MacDougall
Yeah, and what we like to talk about, you know, when we talk with the mastermind, and we help couples, it's, it's the separation between your feeling and the action you take, right? And so that these this example is, it's totally okay to be stressed out. It's totally okay to be angry, like, you know, those are emotions that you're feeling. Now, if you're stressed out, even stressed out for 10 years, probably should go talk to somebody. But I'm saying like, it's normal to have a stress response. It's normal to be angry. Now, when I'm angry, if I decide to punch out my son's teacher, that is not appropriate. No, no. And so again, as you can see, there's a difference between I'm angry. And here's what I do when I'm angry. Right, right. And that's what we want to separate because a lot of people just have a belief that being angry is bad. They're just like, people are angry or bad. They're wrong. 

Kate MacDougall
You shouldn't be angry. I'm like that, right? Any any strong emotion, any emotion that's perceived as negative. I perceive as negative, you know, like by I mean, when you try and divide society, I try to remove it. And that's exactly kind of what in most relationships. You're either doing one of two things, most people unless you're Eric and I also do want

Eric MacDougall
this a very human response, right? 

Kate MacDougall
Yeah, it's very human responses. You're either doing one of two things you're either going in seeing you're stressed out, angry partner and going in and trying to fix, trying to be the clown, make them laugh, trying to brighten up their day buying flowers. Yeah, trying to squash that emotion. So it's no longer they're making you feel uncomfortable. Because what happens when your partner is living that strong emotion, it comes in and messes up with your ecosystem, you're like, well, all my flowers are perfectly growing here. The humidity is perfect in this little ecosystem of mine. You're coming in here like a storm messing it up, like all the petals are flying everywhere, like chill out. So you're like, I'm gonna just try to make you laugh. I'm going to try it. to you know, help you solve your problems like I'm gonna be like way too involved yeah and that

Eric MacDougall
take on all your tasks I'm gonna have a lot of sex with you I'm gonna like everything kids out of the environment 

Kate MacDougall
Yes, I will do absolutely everything so that you feel better

Eric MacDougall
or in order for me to in order

Kate MacDougall
to Yes, exactly. Because really all you're doing is squashing their feelings and you know not to get too deep into this but what you're essentially doing is telling them your feelings don't matter and please stop feeling this way it's making me uncomfortable so stop being you and be better for your to benefit me Exactly. Or you could do another thing which is like the opposite side of the totally opposite side of the spectrum we're looking black and white here. So

Eric MacDougall
the other thing is like there you leave them on an island you completely

Kate MacDougall
retreat you're like stressed out angry closed off your ecosystem with like fortress walls and you're like, don't touch my this is

Eric MacDougall
like when you're telling people to deal with it. You're like, you need to go figure that out. You need to go get help like essentially your what you're saying is not my problem. Get away from me

Kate MacDougall
kicking them out of the house, kicking yourself out of the house, and you know, just really stonewalling them. Yeah, leaving them completely alone to deal with their stuff. And that can probably lead most likely will lead to a spouse that feels lonely, that feels unloved that feels uncared for, and that feels like their feelings, again, don't matter to you because you're too busy protecting your own ecosystem and couldn't care less about theirs that's in complete disarray right

Eric MacDougall
now. Yeah. And again, right, like big picture, what's happening is they internalize this idea is something we internalize even as kids, right, it's this whole idea that there's something wrong with me that I should not be acting this way, that somehow I'm bad or shameful or being angry. And typically, then what that leads to is just either more anger or more shame, which just keeps perpetuating the problem. And so we wanted to do instead is, essentially kind of be in the middle, right. And we don't want to ignore an abandoned partner. But we also don't want to show up as like the saver and take on their problems, right. And so the way that we often talk about it, for us, it's kind of the two prong approach, right? So within the moments when maybe your partner being stressed out, irritated, etc, does an action that's inappropriate, if they yell at your kids, if they're going around insulting everybody, if they're super Curt, if they're, you know, just like genuinely doing things that are like really disrupting other people and being hurtful to others, even like being unkind. Like, I think, if your partner is constantly being unkind to you, you shouldn't be holding up a boundary and saying, Hey, that hurts, you know, I wouldn't appreciate that I'd appreciate if you speak to me a bit differently, or kinder.

Kate MacDougall
Yeah. And it's funny, because we were talking to our therapist to help us with our son. And she was saying that the way we should speak to him is to say, hey, I can see that you're feeling x. And we don't hit people. So so like, say, like, hey, I can see you're feeling angry. And when we're angry, we don't hit people. Yeah. So I mean, when I was listening to that, I was like, you could use the same thing in your marriage, like, Absolutely, I can see that you're really angry. And I really don't think it's a good idea for you to be yelling at the kids right now.

Eric MacDougall
Exactly. Please stop yelling at the kids. You know what I mean? And I think it's important for you to be able to be clear. And you know, we call it loving firmness. But essentially, be clear, be firm, be kind, and upholding, you know, the alliance of your marriage and saying, Hey, like, neither one of us want to be yelling at our kids. Yeah. And so what I'm doing here is I'm holding the bar up, right? So yes, you made a mistake, you're lowering the bar based on what you're experiencing. But in this moment, I'm going to step in and just remind you in a loving, firm way to say, Hey, honey, here's the bar. Okay, so I think, you know, and then maybe your partner can say, Yeah, I'm gonna remove myself, maybe they don't say, hey, maybe you just go take a walk or something, you know, come back when you're, you know, maybe a little more level headed. And so that's really important to do. So what we say is, in the moments, this is where when you want to think you want to think about boundaries, you want to think about not taking on your partner's problems, right? Not taking on all the blame. So in the moment, what you're essentially doing is standing firm in a loving way.

Kate MacDougall
Yeah. And I find myself often times when, you know, when you're experiencing a lot of stress or something, one of my first responses is often like, oh, wow, you look really angry, or you look really stressed. Like, what can I do? And I know that, you know, it's a very kind question to ask and it's a very nice thing to ask your partner. However, when your partner is overwhelmed and stressed and dealing with a bunch of stuff, the last thing they want to do is now also figure out what you can do. So as kind as that response is, and as like quick and natural it is to, like, kind of come out for a lot of us, you know, I often hear people like, speak to another person who's going through something, and it's, you know, Oh, I'm so sorry, you lost your mother, what can I do? And I think in moments like that, when you see somebody who's living a big emotion, it's very important to understand that, to have them think about, okay, now figure out what I can do to help you is not helpful. So instead, a healthy response might be like, I can see you're really overwhelmed. And I am open to taking on making dinner tonight. And, you know, taking on the kids bedtime routine, if you want to work a little more, spend a little more time at work tonight to finish that project you're overwhelmed about. And then that might be a more appropriate approach than just automatically saying, Well, what do you want me to do?

Eric MacDougall
Yeah, I agree. And I think, as you're talking about it, you know, you know, your partner. And this is really important, right? I think what we want to try to avoid here is taking on that emotional toll. And then you kind of losing yourself in the emotion because, you know, I can sit here and we could talk about, you know, oh, like Kate, like, you know what to do, because you're level headed, right? Oh, and I'm not angry, right? It would be very easy for you to be like, Oh, I know what Eric needs, he typically needs this and needs this, he needs this. And if I could do that, that would really help him, you know what I mean? He needs to be witnessed, and he needs to be held, and he needs to be touched, like whatever. And what's really important understand is that, in those moments, when the stress is high, and you see your partner being stressed or angry, the best skill that you can learn is actually to regulate yourself. So you can remember what they need in that moment. A big part of the problem is that if you're not able to regulate yourself, then you end up just reacting to their anger. And when you're reacting, it's to be like, Oh, I see, you're hangry. Like, what do you need, right? And then now you're adding that energy into their system. And it's creating this whole cyclone, right? We call it, you know, adding your shit to their shit. And so I would recommend that in those moments, make sure that you have a good boundary for yourself, to regulate yourself emotionally so that you can keep the bar high. And so you can remember your partner and say, hey, my partner stressed, clearly something's not going well, he probably need some help. And then very quickly, say, what does he need? Right? If he's really being irritated with kids? Maybe he needs the kids to do something very specific. So, honey, just go ahead for a walk, I will take care of the kids bedtime. Okay, I got this. I'm all over it. I will go ahead and execute this.

Kate MacDougall
Yeah. And if you're sitting there thinking like, well, I don't even know like, I don't even know my partner is angry. Like all the time, I don't even know how to help them. And I've offered to do things. I've said specific things, and then they still kind of blow up in the moment. Well, what we would suggest for you to do is, in moments when your partner is not angry or isn't stressed out, or you see it's kind of a more light day for them. That would be a great moment for you to ask that question. Say, hey, when you're angry and stressed, I noticed you were really angry and stressed and I wanted to help you. I really did. I just didn't know, you know exactly how to do it. So you know, when when you're doing this specific thing, you know, and come up with something specific they did you know, or some specific example of something that keeps coming up. You know, what is the good way for me to show up in that moment? What would be something that would be really helpful to you in that moment. And when they're level headed, and when they're held up their healthiest, they'll be able to come up with an answer or something that you can do. And sometimes it's it's like, like for you, Eric. But for example, it's my instinct would be okay, I'm going to take on dinner, I'm going to clean the house, I'm going to take care of the kids, I'm going to do all that. What Eric needs in that moment is to be reminded that he's loved to be touched and hugged, even though in the moment I might touch and hug him and he's gonna get away from me. I don't want this. It's like, sitting in Eric, I know. I know. This is what you need right now. I remember you've told me, this is what you need. Just sit here and try hugging him. And maybe he won't accept it in the moment. But at least I try. And it's something that might work or might not work. Yeah. And you know, and also something that really is important for you is to remind you, Hey, I know right now, you're really overwhelmed with work. I know right? Now, you really want to go downstairs and get lost in this project. But why don't we spend a little bit of time together, like, quietly on the couch, cuddling, like, let's just be together, like really together? Or let's play a game as a family or let's go for a walk as a family. Like let's move our bodies like these are all things that really worked for you. And my first instinct would not be to go for that. But the reason I know these things is because when you're level headed when you're healthy when You had this conversation and you talk to me and you said, this is what I need. And I remember when you said that being so shocked of like, really, like, you don't want me to make dinner, you don't want me to do this. And that like, of course, that's helpful. Like, if you're stressed out and you're like, ah, like, you're most likely going to isolate and go do something else, and probably not make dinner, right. But it's not what you need. And so even though I'm going to make dinner, that's not going to help you get rid of that stress, and it's not going to help you cope with that stress better. It's just going to give you time to think more about it and sit more in it. Yeah.

Eric MacDougall
And I think when we're having those conversations, right, because you're having them outside of the, for lack of better term like fire zone, your partner is able to kind of slow things down and reflect from the human brain instead of the reptilian brain. And so you can have these conversations and really say, hey, in those moments, like, you know, you can start to dissect it. You know, what leads up to that, and I love that you talked about specificity, because that's really important, right? It's not like, hey, when you're stressed, it's handled just yesterday, you know, you around that time, you got kind of angry and started raising your voice to the kids, I could see you were stressed out? Can you tell me what was going on for you in that moment? And then now they're able to reflect and it's specifically supposed to be like, can you tell me why you're all stressed out? Well, that's not really helpful.

Kate MacDougall
And not just that, but it's also putting them in this category of like, You're always like this. And then that puts them directly on the defensive. Whereas if you're like, hey, this one specific moment that lasted maybe an hour Yesterday, you were like this. And so maybe you're sitting here thinking like oh my gosh, no, but mine is truly always stress, still come up with a specific incidents, you don't need to tag them as always being stressed, and always being pissed off, and always this and always, that, they're just gonna go on the defensive. So be kind, you know, think of them in a very positive way, and help them try to come up with solutions for those moments.

Eric MacDougall
Yeah. And I think, you know, in the end, you have to be able to kind of play this double side of holding up boundaries, right? Internal for yourself. So not to take on emotional baggage all the time. But also to really hold up the bar of your relationship and say, Hey, like, we don't yell in our marriage. So we made that agreement. And so I'm holding the bar up, you're yelling, please stop yelling, right. And if they're unable to you walk away, hey, I'm gonna walk away, I'll come back in 10 minutes, hopefully, we can, I can hear you more. Because so that's kind of one part that's really important. It's only on the boundaries. And the other part is understanding, right. And, and really looking at your partner, you know, sometimes I got it, we got a lot of baggage, you know, kidding. I mean, the other 20 years, and, and sometimes it's like, you know, kids super stressed out, I'm super stressed out. And I'm sure both of us, because of the baggage is like, I just want to deal with this shit. Like, get away from me. And but remember, like, as your partner that like your best friend, think about them, like your friend, if you if you saw a friend struggling you want to help them. If your friends stressed out all day, you'd go ask them, Hey, what's up, like you don't seem yourself, you seem a little bit more agitated than usual. I love to understand what's going on for you, right and really hold that space for them. And so really start to think about these two ways that you can start to change the ecosystem of your relationship. Because one of the things that I really want you to remember is that, like, your partner doesn't enjoy being angry all the time, your partner doesn't enjoy being stressed out. They're not like, Oh, I'm so glad that I can hardly sleep. And every morning, I wake up and think about the same thing that drives me insane. Like, they don't like that. And they need help, they can't get out of it. And so you can step in, you can help them you can start to kind of be a mirror and reflect and kind loving way without blaming, but really start to unpack some of the stuff so they can work through it. And if you feel like it's in a really dire place, right, encourage them to reach out for help, or work with them to reach out for help. Hey, uh, you know, if you want me to get a few names, I'm happy to kind of put them in front of yours

Kate MacDougall
start with couples therapy started going together, you know, I think we have some things to talk about. And, you know, that might be a little less intrusive for them to be like, Hey, make an appointment for yourself. It's like, hey, let's talk together, let's go together to talk to somebody together. And that might be a little less intimidating for them. And then therapists might suggest you know, that they go on their own and get their own therapy. So, you know, ideally, together that would work. But sometimes they do need extra help on their own. And that's okay. And to not be afraid to get that help. 

Eric MacDougall
Yeah, absolutely. And if you get any message from this episode at all, just remember, right? Like, emotions are just emotions, your feelings are just feelings. Don't label them as good or bad. Don't try to stop people from having totally okay to be angry, angry. It's nothing wrong with it. But, you know, if you decide to do something that can cause harm or is unkind when you're angry. That's a whole different story. So just remember that right? These emotions are things that we all experience. So if you see your partner being angry, maybe even reflect back to them like Hey, I know what you feel like. I've also been angry. I was angry last week. You know what I mean? And then create that commonality between.